SYW147 – More Art with Caylee Grey

by | Dec 13, 2021 | Podcast | 0 comments

Caylee Grey is the Fairy Artmother at Get Messy, a community of art journalers embracing imperfection and personal storytelling through creative play.

She is warm-hearted and delightful to interview, even turning the tables on me with her curiosity. Caylee is genuinely passionate about both her own creative practice and her business, something we share in common.

Our conversation touches on getting started, making mistakes, and developing a habit, all focused on sharing how you can bring more art into your hobby in 2022.

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Caylee Grey 0:00

You're looking at it and you're seeing these small moments that make up the beauty of your life. And you might see it creatively. You know, when you take the photo you no longer just like pressing the button on your, on your phone. You taking the photo, to, that focuses on the part that you want to remember, or the part that you want to keep or the moment that is important. And I think photos are saying, this moment is important enough to me that I want to live it twice, you know, once when it happens, and then once again when I'm documenting it.

Jennifer Wilson 0:35

Welcome to Scrapbook Your Way, the show that explores the breadth of ways to be a Memory Keeper today. I'm your host, Jennifer Wilson, owner of Simple Scrapper and author of The New Rules of Scrapbooking. This is episode 147.

Jennifer Wilson 0:54

In this episode, I'm joined by Caylee Grey for our conversation about inviting more art into your life in 2022. Caylee is a Memory Keeper, art journaler and the Fairy Artmother behind Get Messy. Hey, Caylee Welcome to Scrapbook Your Way.

Caylee Grey 1:10

My goodness I'm excited to be here.

Jennifer Wilson 1:13

Oh, yes, this is gonna be a fabulous conversation. I'm so looking forward to getting to know you a little bit better. I feel like I've known you online for so long. And now we get to meet, so. So fun.

Caylee Grey 1:24

Yeah, love. I feel like I've known you online for I mean, almost a decade.

Jennifer Wilson 1:30

I know. It is it is. So can you tell us a little bit about yourself?

Caylee Grey 1:35

Okay, I am Caylee Grey, the Fairy Artmother at Get Messy, which just means that I facilitate creation and connection within the community. I am a South African. That's my accent. And I live in Germany with my husband and two children. One of them is a human child and one of them is a furry child.

Jennifer Wilson 1:59

And when did you move to Germany?

Caylee Grey 2:02

Five years ago? I think.

Jennifer Wilson 2:06

Okay.

Caylee Grey 2:08

Yeah. Now we moved here. I mean, I don't know. It's like at the stage now where it feels like forever ago but also yesterday.

Jennifer Wilson 2:17

It's still not quite. Is it? Is it home yet?

Caylee Grey 2:21

It is, I think, yes. It became home very recently where we had gone back to South Africa. And then we came back here and it felt it's weird. It feels weird. But I think having a kid helps things feel like home.

Jennifer Wilson 2:39

I bet, I bet. Yes. Yes. So you are an art journaler, you're passionate about this. And that's going to be the focus of our conversation today. But your origins are a little more in memory keeping and I'm curious what's exciting you right now related to keeping the stories of your life?

Caylee Grey 2:57

Yeah, exciting me. 2022 next year, I think, I think you're the same in that we both love reflecting and making intentions. And so the end of the year is my favorite time of year because I get to look back. And I see what I've done this year, and I'll also realign myself with what, what I want to be doing in life. At the end of last year, I made a vision board. I've only been doing that for a few years, like a visual vision board. I always have goals. Always. The last year was the first time that I did that. And I was looking back at it. And so I had all the like imagery that I wanted. And I realized that I had you know, without too much focus on it. And without making my entire life about about my goals. I've managed to achieve everything that I wanted last year. And you know, not they're not necessarily big things. It's not like make a million dollars. But like true things to me. One of the very exciting things was on the vision board I put that I want to hire a full time employee. And I used a stock image you know of a smiley person sitting at a computer. And I realized that the person that I had hired this year actually looks exactly like that person. So it starts...

Jennifer Wilson 4:26

Oh, wow.

Caylee Grey 4:27

Yes, Yeah, I'm excited about next year. I'm excited about that realignment. I think that's a good word because it's just like coming back to myself and remembering what's important and, and going back on that path.

Jennifer Wilson 4:42

Oh 100% Yeah, I love this time of year because of that. I feel like it's a opportunity to wipe the slate clean a little bit and just Yeah, realignment is is a perfect way to describe it. And you know, thinking about your vision board I hear people so often talk about well the beginning of the year I do these things, and then I don't come back to them. But there's so much power in setting the intention. Because when you go back to it, as you did, you realize this actually happened.

Caylee Grey 5:11

Yes. So I put it on my Notion dashboard. Notion's just, I mean, it's like Evernote or one of those things. And it opens every new tab. So it's there. But it's very passive. Like I'm seeing it passively all the time. And I think we you just put something out into the universe. And you're like, I wouldn't mind if this happens, then the universe sometimes listens.

Jennifer Wilson 5:35

I love that. Yeah. So thinking a little bit more about stories and a little bit of the meaning behind why we create things why we're documenters. Is there something that's on your Bucket List, you mentioned to me that you maybe want to get a little bit more into Project Life or scrapbooking again, so what's on your memory keeping Bucket List?

Caylee Grey 5:57

Okay, so I started all of this with Project like, Life, everything started with Project Life. And the reason it worked for me was just because of the focus on gratitude, and on little moments, and just being thankful for where you are, even if it's very, very, very small things. So I don't know, talking to you now, makes me definitely want to give Project Life, another proper push next year. For the past three years, I haven't done Project Life on a consistent basis. And I've just been wanting to merge Project Life and art journaling. And I think that I have to accept that there is no merging for me. And I'm going to do them both individually. I think that's my like, yeah, you make you, you are making me feel like I really need to take action with Project Life again. But Bucket List Project at the moment, is, I really want to document the story of my body, which is a little bit weird.

Jennifer Wilson 7:11

Oh, interesting.

Caylee Grey 7:14

Well, I mean, it's not like I'm documenting, you know, my son that makes that's a normal one. But my body I think, I think that life reflects art. And and so what I'm currently going through in life is I have a focus on my health, and, you know, eating nutritious meals and building my strength and, and that kind of stuff. And I remember the other day, after a shower, I looked at myself in the mirror, and the stretch marks that I have on my stomach, after having my son there were glistening, kind of like kind of like a snail's trail glistens, like it looked exactly like that. And I looked at them, and I was like, Huh, that's, that's a little bit beautiful. And so ever since then, I've been drawing the pattern of my stretch marks and drawing like, the curve of my body and, and trying to see my physical self as a, an art piece. And I mean, I'm not quite there yet. Like, I don't feel like I'm going to frame myself and put it in the Louve. But, but I think that it's an important journey to go on, in terms of self love, and self acceptance, and all of that. And yeah, so my art currently reflecting that a lot.

Jennifer Wilson 8:39

Oh, that's so beautiful. And I think, something that we probably all could use a little bit of to celebrate our bodies and what they're capable of and where they've been and where we want them to go. So yes, so powerful. Yeah. So dipping a little bit back into this Project Life for next year. Like I'm curious, what role have photos played in your creative process over the past three years when you weren't doing Project Life?

Caylee Grey 9:08

So it's been super interesting. Because with Project Life, it gives you a very good basis for keeping your photos organized, and all of that. So that served me very well. And I've continued with very good, exceptionally good photo organization. I think. I know you love, I know you love that. And I could, I could talk about photo organization for days. I was helping my, my dad, he's become a photographer in his retirement. And so I was helping him share a folder with his friends. Yeah, it's, it's exciting. But I think that the shift now is, I'm taking a lot of photos of details. You know, I was telling you about my stretch marks, I immediately took a photo. And that helped me then be able to draw the pattern. It's helped me digging deeper. You know, yesterday, I had a really delicious cheesecake, and it was beautiful. And I took a photo of it because it had sparked something in me. And I think that it's going to end up. Whereas, you know, Project Life and scrapbooking, you take the photo and you put it in, and then you develop from there. When I use a photo in art journaling it forms. I mean, it's the same, I guess I could form as a basis of ideas on the basis of creative exploration.

Jennifer Wilson 10:36

Well and maybe you were getting exactly what you needed from photos in this, you know, period of time, particularly with you call it the Panini era. And I think that, you know, it's been, it's been a weird time for sure. And to now to think about okay, in this realignment that I have, I'm loving looking a little bit closer and deeper, and how do I need to do something that's a little bit separate from my art journaling to feel fulfilled in that?

Caylee Grey 11:06

Yes, here's, I was talking with an artist yesterday, and we're talking about how art, art isn't just making the art, but it's also the way you seeing the world. So for documenters and Memory Keepers, you're not looking at the world the same way. Someone very logical and practical is looking at it, you looking at it, and you're seeing these small moments that make up the beauty of your life. And you might see it creatively. You know, when you take the photo, you no longer just like pressing the button on your on your phone, you taking the photo to that focuses on the part that you want to remember, or the part that you want to keep, or the moment that is important. And I think photos are saying, this moment is important enough to me that I want to live it twice, you know, once when it happens, and then once again when I'm documenting it.

Jennifer Wilson 12:03

Oh, well, there's like the epic soundbite for this conversation. I love that. All right, let's dive more into your business and what you're doing. So you describe Get Messy as an online art journal school for the imperfect, messy creative with restless hands and a busy mind. That describes me very well. Can you tell us a little about how it came to be and how this community has evolved over time?

Caylee Grey 12:31

Yeah, so Get Messy, funnily enough, is, is kind of, it's like a rallying cry, because I am not somebody who likes to get messy. And I'm not someone who likes to have dirty hands. And I'm very pedantic and exact, and logical. And so getting messy is like an action, right? It's an encouragement, it's a challenge to go past perfection. That's been, that's always my focus I get every time when I'm sitting down. It's that encouragement to like, let go and Get Messy's so intertwined with my own personal journey. I can't separate them. I think. Yeah, the community has evolved, naturally. I haven't had much to do with it. It's been really nice. It's been really nice. It's, you know, you're saying earlier about different stages of lives and different seasons of lives. I think that's a big theme in our creative journeys. You know, sometimes we creating every day and sometimes we creating once a week, once in a blue moon. Sometimes we're not creating at all and all we are creating is the memories and the life that goes into our scrapbooks or our journals. And so what's important to me all the time with Get Messy are three things. It's take what you need, bring your messy self and more than zero is enough. And the idea behind that is you need to know yourself in order to know how much to take in. You know, we live in a world where you can way take in way, way, way more than you need. And so you need to know what you need at this specific stage. And then bringing your messy self you know, imperfection is beautiful and great and that's exactly how we want to come to our journals. We don't you know, our journals or our scrapbooks or whatever medium we use. The best part is the imperfect part. The best part is exactly what things are the real stuff, the true stuff, at the yeah, the mess, essentially. And then the more than zero is enough part is if you're doing something that's not nothing. That is the best, that is the best you don't have to be doing In all the projects, you don't have to be doing every idea that you come across and everything everyone else is doing. Just doing a little bit is amazing. And it's so worth celebrating and just Yeah, I think I think that's important because sometimes a perfectionist selves, our professional self tells us you have to do it in exactly XYZ way. Otherwise it doesn't, it doesn't matter. But that's just not true.

Jennifer Wilson 15:34

Well and I think even our creative curiosities though, like, make us want to do all the things even though we know it's not feasible or practical, right? That's also the challenge. Like we want to eat everything on the buffet, but we know it's gonna make us not feel so good.

Caylee Grey 15:49

Exactly, exactly. But I think yet, Jennifer, what do you like? Because I feel like you are. I mean, the whole, the whole process of this podcast has been very refined and amazing. Tell me how you see, like, how do you get projects done?

Jennifer Wilson 16:11

You know, it's been very much an evolution over time. And I feel like I've grown along with my community to figure out okay, what are the fundamentals that help us do stuff, and I and I've been thinking about this really recently, like that, there's two things. One is we need some sort of rails or boundary. And a lot of times, that's just a decision of this is how I'm going to do it. And to be really specific about this is what I'm doing. It's not, I'm scrapbooking, I'm creating art. It's, I'm doing this project, which looks like this, and this is how I know it's gonna be done. And then the whole flip side of that is to be able to create accountability systems for yourself that help you show up to it. Whether it's a time on the calendar, or a friend that encourages you, or it really has nothing to do with what you're creating, but how you make the time to sit down and do anything. And so when you have those two things together, that's how you get stuff done.

Caylee Grey 17:09

Yes. Do you think it's like having you create the boundaries, and then within those boundaries, you can unleash yourself?

Jennifer Wilson 17:18

Oh, yes. 100%. Yes, I know when I'm working on a project. In during October, I had this really tiny kit of supplies. And I felt so creatively energized by having a really small set of things to work from, rather than, you know, all the things.

Caylee Grey 17:35

Yes, yes.

Jennifer Wilson 17:38

And when you were talking about kind of your, your three values and things that you share with your community, or your these, these passion points. This speaks so well to kind of his balance that we have as guides and educators and content creators, and the creative person's experience because we're creating all this stuff. And how do we make our people not feel like it's a total hamster wheel? Like, that's our job to feel like sometimes it's the hamster wheel. That's not their job. Their job is to take what they need, and to know that anything they do is amazing.

Caylee Grey 18:17

Yes. Yeah. Do you? Do you find yourself? I'm interested, okay. So when you are recording a lesson, or you're sharing something, and you absolutely screw up something, in your opinion that you, you do something in you like, that looks terrible. What do you do then?

Jennifer Wilson 18:41

Hmm, it depends. Yeah, sometimes I will brush it off and try to make it into something new or celebrate the imperfection. And sometimes that part gets cut out or I start over. So I think it just depends on how, how I'm feeling at that time. Like how much I kind of full of possibility or acceptance, I guess.

Caylee Grey 19:12

Interesting. Yeah, during a lot about the...

Jennifer Wilson 19:15

What do you do?

Caylee Grey 19:17

Well, yeah, I've been wondering about the way creatives create and what they share. And I think art journaling, there's more room for splashes of paint, whereas memory keeping it's the I don't know, it feels more limited, but like within, but there's freedom in that limitation. You know, like a Project Life album. You have to put the photos in the in the pockets. You can't just do what you know, there's that structure. And like we were saying with, with the creative habit and making sure that you do actually create, you create those structures to put in the wild abandon. And so Project Life. It's the pocket pages. And I think that's why I like them. You know, for me the 12 by 12 pages tall, way too scary. I don't think I could ever...

Jennifer Wilson 20:10

Go back to that.

Caylee Grey 20:13

Yeah. But yeah, when I'm teaching, I think there's a there's a process that people can learn from the process of continuing from mistakes. Or...

Jennifer Wilson 20:28

Yes.

Caylee Grey 20:29

What you don't like, because it's also not, not objective mistake, it's just to you a mistake or just to you something that you'd prefer not to be on the page.

Jennifer Wilson 20:40

Well, I think there's also a weird thing that happens with me is that if I'm, especially if I'm doing something live, I, I can't see it until I've stepped away. And sometimes it's literally a physical, I need to be further away from this to see how it has all come together. And then I will often make final changes after I've taught something live, because that's that would be, that would, that would be my normal process. Is that I would kind of do most of it, step away for a little bit, and then figure out okay, what are the final changes I need to make for this to be finished in my eye? And so doing it live is a different time period. That's not not as natural for me.

Caylee Grey 21:22

Yeah, yeah.

Jennifer Wilson 21:25

But in talking about mistakes, I have this a great example of, I have been on this journey of fixing the spine of an album for my December Daily project, and I sanded off a 2015 date so that I could use the album this year. And then I adhered a star and that's in place, and it was beautiful. And then when I went to go look to see did it stick well enough, there was some sort of smudge on the outside of the star that I could not remove. And I was like, Oh my gosh, this is disaster. But instead I put another star on top of it. So now it's a double layered star. Like, I think I fixed it. And I'm just trying to run with it and embrace that. Now, it's just more interesting.

Caylee Grey 22:08

Yes, yes. More interesting.

Jennifer Wilson 22:11

Yes.

Caylee Grey 22:11

So good, because I think that, that being creative gives us permission in other areas of our lives. An example like if I want to buy a dress that I never would have normally wore, because you know, what would my mom say? And what would all these people say? Now I'm just like, I'm an artist, I can wear that. Or I'm an artist, I don't need to brush my hair today. It's like, it's that permission to just have the stuff that is usually seen as mess, as simply creative, or that's just that's just artistic. And so that star, I would like to say he just wants to be a little individual, you know, he wants to have that, like, unvarnished look. Maybe he needs a friend to get him to look polished.

Jennifer Wilson 23:07

Oh, that's a wonderful way to look at it. But I think those of us who like more logical, linear, less mess, sometimes it can be hard to get to dig deep sometimes to find that acceptance.

Caylee Grey 23:23

Yes, it is not easy. And I think it's even for people who have been doing that for a long time. It doesn't mean that it's not a struggle anymore. It just means that you've learned to not listen to those voices or just just accept, okay, the voices are here. They always come. I'm going to be fine. Let's continue.

Jennifer Wilson 23:48

Yes. And to know that sometime in the future, when you look back on it, you'll just think, Oh, that was cute. You know, that was a, that looks beautiful, or that's amazing. You're not going to think about oh, well, I had to cover that up because something was messed up. You don't.

Caylee Grey 24:02

Completely.

Jennifer Wilson 24:03

Yeah. So I'm thinking back to, now Get Messy started as you're doing challenges on Instagram. Is that what I'm remembering?

Caylee Grey 24:12

Yeah. On blogs.

Jennifer Wilson 24:14

Yeah, from the blog way back. And then now you have this amazing membership community with so much content. Can you talk about the type of experience you want to create for your members kind of going a little further on what you were mentioning before?

Caylee Grey 24:29

Yeah. Definitely one of acceptance and acceptance in the imperfections of feeling that you're not alone in this. You know, like you were saying, You've, you've developed over the course of your journey and with your members you've like developed alongside them. Same as me, and, you know, I, when Get Messy started, I was incredibly lonely. I was just about to emigrate for the first time. And so Get Messy became a haven for those who don't have people that necessarily get what they're doing. And I think everything goes back to that imperfection and just being told that it's fine. Perfect, boring. Imperfection is where the interesting things happen and and we're all imperfect and it's Yeah, fine, fine, fine, fine.

Jennifer Wilson 25:36

100% Yes, for sure. That reminds you so much of when I started Simple Scrapper it was because I had just moved into a house with my husband, and two stepsons and a big dog. And it was a very tiny house. And so I kind of locked myself in the bedroom with my cat, and discovered scrapbooking.

Caylee Grey 25:57

Really?

Jennifer Wilson 25:58

Totally.

Caylee Grey 25:59

So you were hiding away from the dog. That's hilarious.

Jennifer Wilson 26:03

Yes, it was. It was a challenging time. It would, mean it was amazing. Because I was so excited to be married and start this new life. But I'm like, Oh, how do I adapt to all this change at once? I've got to find something that's just for me.

Caylee Grey 26:16

Oh, yes. It's kind of like you went into yourself and you hang out with yourself a bit. Oh, I love it.

Jennifer Wilson 26:24

Yeah, yeah. So yeah, we've talked a lot about kind of just different formats of creating, but even within art journaling, just like within scrapbooking. It's so diverse in style and format, technique and what your, how it looks, and what you're using to create it. Why is it so important to you to showcase that across your Get Messy Instagram account and inside of your membership? Because I just I've noticed that it's not just the way Caylee creates its way all these beautiful people create?

Caylee Grey 26:55

Yeah. So in my opinion, just one voice is like boring as hell. It's, it's not interesting. And I always say that I'm not, you know, I'm not the best artist in the world, objectively, or subject, it doesn't matter. But I can, I think I can help others be their best artists. And I don't believe in competition, you know. So every time we have new artists sharing inside the community, I'm 100% going to give all the links to their sites. And even if they've also got an exactly the same art journal membership, I'm going to link that and encourage people to follow what resonates with them. Because all I want is for someone to be creating, I just want people to create and feel the feeling of creating and living a creative life. And whether that comes from me, or it comes from someone else, that it always makes me happy. And so yeah, so if we've got all the different voices, it's just, it's just repetition that what you're making is great. And what you're making is beautiful. And all of its beautiful, even, even the stuff that you might think is not great. It's all, it's all beautiful, because it's true. And it's you and who you are.

Jennifer Wilson 28:25

Well and I love that you're not, you're trying to kind of break through this idea of of competition within the creative world, too. Because I think sometimes there's that not so talked about undercurrent, and the more that we actively work against it, I think the more that we can just embrace it, everyone has something valuable to offer.

Caylee Grey 28:46

Exactly. And I think this the whole is greater than the sum of its parts, right? If we have, what everyone's creating individually is great. But if we put all together, it's so much more. And it's exciting. And I think everyone has something to say. And that's, the that's the nice thing with telling stories is that every single person, even if they have the same experiences, they'll tell it differently. We are lucky with the internet because we you know, have so access to so many different walks of lives, life and ways of seeing things. It's just so much more interesting.

Jennifer Wilson 29:29

Oh, for sure. I think that Yeah. It just it really is to just experience someone's viewpoint through their supplies, even if you gave 10 people the same supplies, they would all create something different. Right?

Caylee Grey 29:47

And even if you sit down with the same supplies one day later or one hour later.

Jennifer Wilson 29:55

Yeah. You know, at the same time, though, I think there is value In following along, trying to take an example and say, Okay, can I make something that looks like that as a way of learning how to hold your hand or how to cut something or whatever it is that you're doing. Because there's, the more that you practice certain things, the more you can incorporate them into your own ideas.

Caylee Grey 30:19

Exactly. And that's how you're going to find out what you like, right? If you just if you take a whole bunch of things, you just try each of them. And you just keep whatever you whatever you enjoyed. That's how you create stuff that comes from the soul and comes from the heart and is in tune with what you love.

Jennifer Wilson 30:37

Mm hmm. Yeah, this reminds me of, I have taken some classes this past year from Scrapbook and Cards Today, these Crop and Create Delivered. And these are like fairly traditional, they're sending you a box of scrapbook supplies. They're very like thematic. They're fun projects, but they're very kind of outside of the realm of how I would traditionally create. But I have learned all these different techniques that made me realize I like dimension and texture and popping things up. So they they look three dimensional. And that's something that I've been very, I don't know, not against, but just thought I was I liked flat things in the past. And so but because I kind of just said, I let go and I embraced something that was totally different. I was able to discover something that fits into my normal creative routines too. So I love that.

Caylee Grey 31:28

Yeah, I love how you phrase that. So good.

Jennifer Wilson 31:33

So we've talked a lot about perfectionism already. But I'm curious why you think our journaling can be a really helpful practice for perfectionists.

Caylee Grey 31:44

Okay, well, I am a perfectionist, obviously, I think most people are perfectionists. So I'm a recovering perfectionist, let's call it you know, every day I am trying to make It's the voice inside of my head. And I think the journal is magical in particular, because it is by in like, by definition, it's a rough draft. You know, historically, a journal is something that you keep with a lock and key, you hide it away, you don't let anyone read it. And so that idea that it's just yours, and it's casual, it's light hearted, you know, you're not working on an expensive piece of canvas, your journal could cost $1, you know, there's no restraints, it's just very naturally easy and low barrier. And the nice thing about a journal, if you do something that you don't like, you just turn the page, you know, if you make something on a canvas or another medium, and you don't like it, you feel a bit guilty, maybe to throw it away, because it costs you a whole bunch of money, or it takes up so much space. And a journal just really is whatever you need it to be. I know a lot of people that burn their journals afterwards, which is exciting and awesome. And I can't do that, I would rather just just thrown into the recycling. But that the temporary nature of it, and the private nature of it is is pretty cool to me.

Jennifer Wilson 33:29

How do you balance the the inherently private nature of it with a desire to share online because we also like a little bit of pats on the back for you made a cool thing.

Caylee Grey 33:42

I know, it has it's been a process. I often have to take a step away from Instagram, because that's the main place that I share. But I think once I've finished something in my journal part of letting go of it, and becoming not attached to it is to share it online. And I think in the creative space that we are both in, people are actually very nice. We don't have a lot of trolls. I mean, they they're still there. But for the most part people are nice. And so yes, yes. You weren't really ever put something out there because the people that are all looking at it are art journals and scrapbookers and people that are dabbling in creativity themselves. So they understand. It's not about like the finished piece. It's about the process that it took to get there that understand you know, what goes into that and and the benefit of it outside of looking beautiful. So yeah, so when when I'm sharing online, I've already let it go in my head. And so it doesn't really matter what everyone says it's just like closing the chapter for me.

Jennifer Wilson 34:58

Mm hmm. I like that as a way of just release of, of moving on to the next thing, and it served its purpose for you, now hopefully it can serve a purpose for someone else.

Caylee Grey 35:08

Yeah, exactly. And I think my scrapbooks and my Project Life albums, my December Dailies, they're all on my shelves at home. And I've never looked back on them. I cannot look back on them. But my partner and my son, freakin love it. They love it.

Jennifer Wilson 35:27

Awe.

Caylee Grey 35:28

Yeah. Kind of weird.

Jennifer Wilson 35:29

Does that feed into any desire to want to do more?

Caylee Grey 35:34

Yes. Yes, unfortunately. Maybe I think maybe the season I'm going through with the art journaling is a season of focusing on myself. Maybe it's like me hiding in my room with my cat, my version of that?

Jennifer Wilson 35:52

Yeah.

Caylee Grey 35:52

And reconnected myself. And I think, you know, I'm feeling pretty full with that at the moment. So maybe I'm ready to start, you know, documenting more of my son's life in that way.

Jennifer Wilson 36:06

I think we always have to go through these periods of marination. We talked about that a lot here on the podcast, where you, you know, there's something coming, but you don't have a clear vision for it yet. Because maybe you want to bring something into it. Maybe you want to find a way to merge some aspects of your art journaling process with your Project Life, like maybe cutting pieces out and putting them in the pockets to say, here's a here's a slice of what I made this past week. And then to just sit with that is sit with the uncomfortableness of it. And that's what's going to lead you towards having a clear vision and a clear plan.

Caylee Grey 36:44

Yeah, man, do you know what? I think you've nailed it. It's, I'm not, I'm not ready to be uncomfortable. I've been comfortable for so long. And maybe that's an encouragement that I need to be...

Jennifer Wilson 36:57

Uncomfortable. Yeah.

Caylee Grey 36:58

I need to be an uncomfortable beginner again.

Jennifer Wilson 37:02

Yes. Yes. That's how I feel about art journaling.

Caylee Grey 37:07

Oh, well, you know what I want to do now? I want to give you a challenge.

Jennifer Wilson 37:13

This could be interesting.

Caylee Grey 37:14

Oh, no, it's very scary. Which means that it's good.

Jennifer Wilson 37:20

No, I, huh. We're gonna have to keep talking about this. But let's see, I think this next question here, kind of really dives into this. As, as our listeners are thinking about what they want to incorporate into their creative practice next year, what do you see as the most common roadblock for those who want to create more, or even just get started with something that maybe is new and uncomfortable?

Caylee Grey 37:48

I don't want to be a hypocrite going on from this. I mean, it's, you know, the, the truth is that the biggest barrier always is just you. Like my biggest barriers me. I can disguise that by saying, you know, I don't have time, or don't have the supplies. In the end. It's just me, I just need to sit down. Do it. Sit with uncomfortableness? If, for practical tips, I think a very good way to sit through that is to sit through it with someone else. And to follow tutorial and do it step one, step two, step three, you know, and yes, and you don't need to always pull from your own courage you can pull from the courage of someone else.

Jennifer Wilson 38:37

Very well said, yes. That's, it's so amazing. Because sometimes it's the showing up and if you can work past your own self to show up and just sit there and you know, and there's many examples we've already shared. Follow someone else's courage, someone else has already done the create, the quote, unquote, creative hard work. So if you can show up and do that, it builds your muscles to be able to do more.

Caylee Grey 39:04

Showing up, yes. And, and you can also use the resources of someone else, not only from the knowledge you can also, you know, show up to a crop like you have a bunch of crops within your community. Get my CS Hangouts. Sure up, see other people doing it too.

Jennifer Wilson 39:25

Yes.

Caylee Grey 39:26

Massive encouragement.

Jennifer Wilson 39:28

But I think you've hit really on what it is, is the roadblock is not, I'm disorganized or I don't have the right supplies or I don't even have skill. It's something, it's in your head. The roadblock is inside of us.

Caylee Grey 39:41

There's a book called The Mountain Is You. It's a, it's not a good book. She kind of like reached her peak for the book with the title.

Jennifer Wilson 39:53

Okay.

Caylee Grey 39:54

So you don't need to read it. But yeah, knowing that the mountain is you and that's what you need to conquer. Which is simple, but not easy.

Jennifer Wilson 40:03

But even just knowing it can to help, helps us start working through it.

Caylee Grey 40:07

Very helpful.

Jennifer Wilson 40:10

Yeah, and just being able to, and I think that's, that's the thing that I think both of us tried to do is to. Creating is not just about what you're doing with your hands, and the stuff, there's the mental process that we have to work through. And so to ask these, you know, thoughtful questions that get people looking at their lives and creative practices differently, makes makes a difference in their experience.

Caylee Grey 40:39

Completely. I think a phrase that you can say to yourself with these uncomfortable bits while you're feeling it, is just this is okay. It's all okay, like, feeling uncomfortable is okay. Making something that's outside of your scope? Is okay, and it looks okay. And it's okay, you're fine. Everything's fine. I don't know, that helps me at least.

Jennifer Wilson 41:07

Oh, yeah. No, I can, I want to try that myself. So I want to talk about your book. So this is called Get Messy Art. And can you tell us when it comes out?

Caylee Grey 41:22

With the panini, it's been delayed. The current date is 14th of December.

Jennifer Wilson 41:29

So that is right after this episode is scheduled to go live.

Caylee Grey 41:32

Great timing.

Jennifer Wilson 41:34

And what would you say is the kind of the core message that you were trying to impart on the readers in this book?

Caylee Grey 41:41

Core message of the book is the same as the core message of the membership. Which is there, no rules, no judgment, no pressure. Just make art, make something.

Jennifer Wilson 41:54

I'm curious, how was the experience and putting it together versus maybe the comfort zone of creating content for your community?

Caylee Grey 42:02

Mm hmm. So it's, it's been weird, because there's, it's involved a lot of trust. You all know, when you run your own business, there's a lot of control. And it's wonderful, and I love control. And so knowing that there was going to be a group of people that would kind of take my words and my photos and my art, and turn it into something that's like, still mine, but not really mine. That was scary as hell. And that was the most difficult part of the process for me, was accepting that, you know, the writing was fine, the projects were fine, completely used to that. That came way easier than I expected. And then I let it go and let everyone else have it. And had to take a lot of deep breaths. But I was very lucky with my team, my editor, Janine, is, I call her my Fairy Bookmother, because she is amazing. And at every stage, she made sure that even though I wasn't doing, you know, the layout of the book, the final editing, even though I had the final say, you know, I wasn't physically creating the documents that became the book, which is what I usually do. It still somehow looked like me, it still looked like decisions that I would have made, which is, I don't know how they managed to do that. It's amazing.

Jennifer Wilson 43:38

That's amazing. Yeah, no, it's, I mean, that's a sign of, I think, a really good team who was able to really pay attention and look closely to who you are, and what your your style, what your preferences are, to understand that and carry that through the book. So that's so exciting.

Caylee Grey 43:54

But I think you are like that too. Because, you know, going on to someone's podcast is a bit of a giving up of control and a bit of a have a big display of trust. And you did a really good job with noticing. And, you know, I love the questions that you asked me and it's very nice to feel seen. I think that's because of what a good noticer you are.

Jennifer Wilson 44:20

Oh, thank you. Yeah. So some of our recent conversations have been about our Hobonichi planners. So I sort of want to end here is talking a little bit about this. Particularly as I know, we have a lot of listeners who are thinking about what planner they want to use next year and and not only the functionality of that, but the the how this fits into our like creative desk, I guess. So I want to know how it's going with your planner and your cover that you have that you sewed. And I think you've been, have you been doing more to it? I'm trying to to follow the story.

Caylee Grey 44:58

I've been ridiculous. I mean, I've been sending you the most ridiculous, specific questions. And that's why I love the internet because I can't ask anyone else like, I like I was asking you, How do you write the time? Like, how do you, how are you okay with these? Weird questions. But currently on my desk, I have 1,2,3,4,5,6 planners on my desk.

Jennifer Wilson 45:22

Okay.

Caylee Grey 45:23

I've got my main one, which is what I, you know, I saw my name written in your Hobonichi and you are written in my one, too. It is going exceptionally well. I went through a period where I used only my iPad and Good Notes for my planning. And of course, I've got all my digital planning, but having a paper planner is, I don't know, you just that tactileness of just writing things on paper is so helpful.

Jennifer Wilson 45:50

Or crossing them off. That's like that's my favorite part is being able to cross things off.

Caylee Grey 45:54

Do you cross off tasks?

Jennifer Wilson 45:56

Oh, I do! Yeah, I'll have to send you a photo of what my, this week's planner looks like, now.

Caylee Grey 46:05

Yeah, that is this. So I have kept I have not kept all of my art journals. 100% and I have not kept all of my scrapbooking projects. But what I have kept is all of my planners, because I think that it tells such a good story of your life. You know, they're...

Jennifer Wilson 46:24

That's so fascinating.

Caylee Grey 46:25

Right? They that the tiniest details are so interesting, like, who was a meeting? What were my goals? What were my what was on my to do list because it shows you what's important to you at that time.

Jennifer Wilson 46:41

So I'm curious are, is it your desire, is it your heart's desire to have five planners on your desk next year?

Caylee Grey 46:50

So you see, this is like we you have to do what works for you. Because I've always felt bad, always wanted to be the type of person that just has one journal. And that was it. Also want to be the type of person that kept all of my personal journal, journaling in one journal and all of my work journaling in another and all of my work planning in another and I've just realized everything just mixes together. And...

Jennifer Wilson 47:18

You're only one person. Yeah.

Caylee Grey 47:20

Yeah, but the, the way that I go about organizing it, and this might be quite extra, is I have a lot of brain vomit. Like that's my step one, to all of this, to memory keeping, to art journaling, to planning is our brain vomit. That is, it makes me exceptionally mentally healthy. And I know when I'm struggling mentally, it's probably because I haven't let go of all the stuff in my head. And then from there, I can then you know, scan it in and put it on my computer and that's a little bit. But I enjoy it. It helps me process things, getting it off my head and maybe some people process things inside their head and they don't need five, five planners. I must say okay, the planners currently on my desk, it's two that are for next year, because I've been doing a lot of work with next year's shedule. I've got one main planner, and then one for writing podcast notes in because I think with my pen. And so I've been like writing throughout the conversation. And then the other two I don't know why they're here, they don't actually even need to be here.

Jennifer Wilson 48:32

No judgement at all. I'm just trying to help guide you towards towards what more of what you want and to make sure it's, you know, meeting your needs. So, yes, yes. And, and so Okay, talking specifically about the Hobonichi. What did you decide about the super fancy cover? Did you return it?

Caylee Grey 48:52

I didn't, I kept it in the end. I kept in and I'm not, I hated it for a while. I hated it and then and I still do prefer. So the one that I got is the Liberty Fabrics one and I love Liberty Fabrics. It's the floral pattern but the inside looked really cheap. And while I was waiting for it, I just took a bunch of Liberty Fabrics and just covered my own journals with it and hand sewed it. And I think I've become endeared towards the handmade look and maybe that's what's getting to me. But at the moment I've just got like a mishmash of options. My two, I don't know the terminology yet, cousins, avec because it's the two of them for the whole year, they're still uncovered I haven't decided what to do with him yet.

Caylee Grey 48:52

Okay, cuz I I'm currently using mine uncovered for this year but for next year, I did buy, actually, I asked my mom to buy for me, the fancy cover. And so I have one that's like, it's like a pink and blue and green plaid. Like kind of a hand drawn plaid. Yeah. So I'm gonna be using that next year, and I'm really excited about it. But I'm also feeling like, ooh isn't going to get dirty? Like, am I somehow gonna mess it up, because it's so nice. Being on my desk.

Caylee Grey 50:23

That proper might, as soon as you've got fancy things, they become precious. And then you don't want to use them. And that's not the point. So maybe I like the idea that my journals are not precious. And then that encourages me to just use it.

Jennifer Wilson 50:37

I think I just need to keep more wet wipes around.

Caylee Grey 50:44

Oh, my gosh, we just finished our Amazon Subscribe and Save subscription for wet wipes. Because we had it for my son when he was a baby. And then I just kept it going because it's so good for acrylic paint.

Jennifer Wilson 50:58

Oh, yes, yes. Yeah, we stocked up because of the toilet paper shortage, and now I'm using it for my stamps.

Caylee Grey 51:10

It's very good.

Jennifer Wilson 51:13

All right, Caylee, this has been so fun. Yeah, both very important and significant as we talk about this realignment for next year, and what we want, what we both want out of next year. Awesome to hear about what's happening with Get Messy. And can you maybe share, what anything, maybe some sneak peeks of what's coming in 2022?

Caylee Grey 51:35

Oh, goodness, I can't I can't share that yet. Because I haven't shared with the Get Messies yet. But my goodness, there's one thing that I'm very excited about. I don't want to be that type of person that says I can't talk about it. But I'm just excited about more art in 2020. And whatever ways we get to that. That's yeah, that's the exciting bit. And my book, obviously.

Jennifer Wilson 52:01

Will you have will you have told them by December 13?

Caylee Grey 52:05

Yes, yes. And I can openly share a link with you then.

Jennifer Wilson 52:09

Okay, because nobody will have heard this until December 13.

Caylee Grey 52:12

I know, I know. I can share a link because I'll share that. I'll share the plans but I can't talk about them yet. Feels weird.

Jennifer Wilson 52:18

All right. I get it. I get.

Caylee Grey 52:20

It feels like I'm cheating on them, you know?

Jennifer Wilson 52:22

Oh, 100%. Yes. So okay, can you share where we can find you online?

Caylee Grey 52:29

Yeah. CayleeGrey on Instagram. That's like a whole bunch of E's in there. GetMessyArtJournal, on Instagram. GetMessyart.com on the internet.

Jennifer Wilson 52:43

That's amazing. Thank you so much for spending time. And I'm so looking forward to being on your podcast coming up soon as well.

Caylee Grey 52:50

Yeah.

Jennifer Wilson 52:51

And I'm just so glad that we could connect. I think there's something possible here with some maybe a trading of encouragement for for the new year.

Caylee Grey 52:59

Yes, totally. Totally, totally.

Jennifer Wilson 53:02

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